suspended chords

Basically yes.

Strictly speaking, the sus4 is the only sus chord, but the sus2 has honorary membership.

7sus4 and 6sus4 chords are sometimes wrongly written sus7 or sus6 , which could trick you into thinking that their chord formula was 1-b7-5 or 1-6-5 when it is in fact more likely to be 1-4-5-b7 or 1-4-5-6.

If there is no n, as in Csus, it stands for sus4.

Thanks, Helgi.  
If the sus2 has only honorary membership, what is its real name?
Tim

If the sus2 has only honorary membership, what is its real name?

sus2

I studied greybeads charts quite a bit and it made me understand the difference between a sus4 and a sus2.  Say you play an open A then suspend it by putting your pinky on fret forward like:

E: --0--
B: --3--
G: --2--
D: --2--
A: --0--
E: --X--

This is an Asus4.  That pinky "suspends" the chord.  I suppose like your mind anticipated an A chord and now you're brightening it.  So if you lift your pinky totall off you get:

E: --0--
B: --0--
G: --2--
D: --2--
A: --0--
E: --X--

which is an Asus2.  The way I think of it is, for a major chord, the 3rd

one fret forward is a sus4
two frets backward is a sus2

For a minor chord the 3rd:

two frets forward is a sus4
one fret backward is a sus2

Just my weird way of thinking of it.

sus4 chords replace the 3rd with a 4th, as you noted.  sus2 chords do the same.

In traditional harmony, a suspension is a note held over from a prior chord... for example, when changing from G to Dsus4, the G is held over, then resolves down a half step (to F#) to reach D major.

Closely related are 'add' chords, which include the 3rd (add4 = 1-3-4-5; add2 is usually written as add9, and would be 1-2-3-5).

Tom

sus4 chords replace the 3rd with a 4th, as you noted.  sus2 chords do the same.

In traditional harmony, a suspension is a note held over from a prior chord... for example, when changing from G to Dsus4, the G is held over, then resolves down a half step (to F#) to reach D major.

Closely related are 'add' chords, which include the 3rd (add4 = 1-3-4-5; add2 is usually written as add9, and would be 1-2-3-5).

Tom

Cool.  Why add9 instead of add2?
Tim

I could be wrong, but consider a normal 9 chord.

1-3-5-7-9

Drop the 7 and you have

1-3-5-9

Or in the key of C

C-E-G-D

A 'normal' 9 chord has a b7; it's a dominant chord.  If you want 1-3-5-7-9, that's a Major 9 chord... sevenths and extended chords (9ths, 11ths, 13ths) imply a dominant sound -- the Major is rare enough that it's noted as such.

'Add 9' says you're putting in the 9th WITHOUT a 7th.  Depending on the progression, your ear might imply a major 7 or a dominant 7 to the chord.

Going back to traditional harmony, all chords are in thirds.  The common exceptions would be the sus4 (it's not an 11th, because there's no 7th in the chord, and it resolves down to the 3rd, which is easier to visualize if you call it a 4th), and the 6th chord... which isn't a 13th because it's not dominant.

Tom

Tom

A 'normal' 9 chord has a b7; it's a dominant chord.  If you want 1-3-5-7-9, that's a Major 9 chord... sevenths and extended chords (9ths, 11ths, 13ths) imply a dominant sound -- the Major is rare enough that it's noted as such.

I was talking about intervals in general - you can use the same formula for a minor 9th, only with a flattened third. It's still 1-3-5-7-9 in that mode.

Ok... I had to ponder that for a moment...

In A minor, the notes A-C-E-G-B fall into pattern 1-3-5-7-9, and they do make a minor 9th chord.  So... in that respect, you're right.

But consider the formula for a minor chord -- it's 1-b3-5, right?  And in A minor, that would be A-Cb-E, which is NOT a minor chord.  You always measure intervals from a Major scale, not whatever minor or mode you happen to be in -- otherwise a chord will have many, many names as the melody over it changes!

In A major, the formula for a minor 9th chord goes 1-b3-5-b7-9.  That's because the C (3rd) and G (7th) are normally sharped notes.

The b7 (G natural) makes the minor 9th chord a dominant one.

Tom

But consider the formula for a minor chord -- it's 1-b3-5, right?  And in A minor, that would be A-Cb-E, which is NOT a minor chord.  You always measure intervals from a Major scale, not whatever minor or mode you happen to be in -- otherwise a chord will have many, many names as the melody over it changes!

I'm trying to say that that is how you construct a 9th chord - it doesn't matter what the major scale is, you're using ascending thirds over the mode. For instance, in C, Dm9 would use the 1st, 3rd, 5th, 7th, and 9th degrees of the Dorian mode, which are D-F-A-C-E.

You're right in that they are always in thirds... and from C Major, you can construct a D minor 9th on the Dorian mode, an E minor 9th on the Phrygian mode, and an A minor 9th on the Aeolian mode, and you'll get a minor 9th chord.

If we look at the triads formed from a Major scale, you'd expect to get Major-minor-minor-Major-Major-minor-diminished.

However, if you form a 9th chord from the 4th step of C (Lydian mode, we'd expect a Major), you'll get F-A-C-E-G, and from the 5th step (Mixolydian mode, we'd also expect a Major), you'll get G-B-D-F-A.  If you play these two chords, you'll see that their characters are not the same...

The chord formula for the first (from an F major scale) is 1-3-5-7-9, and the second (from a G major scale) is 1-3-5-b7-9.  You get an F Major 9th, and a G dominant 9th.

If you were to start from G in a G major scale, you'd get G-B-D-F#-A, which is a G major 9th.  If you started from the G note in a D scale, you'd also get G-B-D-F#-A.

Because building the same chord in thirds from different modes gets you different results, it's simplest to learn the chord formulas from the Major scale that shares the chord root.

This makes determining a chord a simple process: here's the root, there's the chord.

If you build all your chord formulas from the various modes, you need to do a more convoluted process: here's the root... it's the x step from the key... so y is the root of the key... so I'm in the z mode... so this is such-and-such a chord.

Tom

However, if you form a 9th chord from the 4th step of C (Lydian mode, we'd expect a Major), you'll get F-A-C-E-G, and from the 5th step (Mixolydian mode, we'd also expect a Major), you'll get G-B-D-F-A.  If you play these two chords, you'll see that their characters are not the same...

Yep, that's because you're basing the chords off two different modes. Diatonically, they're both in the key of C.
The chord formula for the first (from an F major scale) is 1-3-5-7-9, and the second (from a G major scale) is 1-3-5-b7-9.  You get an F Major 9th, and a G dominant 9th.

I'd tend to think of it in terms of modes, it makes more sense to me to memorize chords in terms of different degrees of the mode.
If you build all your chord formulas from the various modes, you need to do a more convoluted process: here's the root... it's the x step from the key... so y is the root of the key... so I'm in the z mode... so this is such-and-such a chord.

It's not that convoluted when you remember that a mode is just a major scale that starts and ends on a different degree. I guess we're just two completely different thinkers, and I doubt we'd be able to talk any sense into each other.

You're probably right about that... and to each their own, I suppose.

However, if you ever want to write charts for other people to play, and you note a chord as D9, you may not get the results you want.  They'll all be using a C natural in any key, you'll be using C# if you're playing in the key of D or A.

Tom