More on Minor Scales

First what if the minor key is a minor seventh chord ? ( or minor 9th, or 11th or 13th )

First, let me rephrase your question for the benefit of anyone who might be confused by it.

"What if a song in a minor key contains a minor 7th chord on the first scale note?"

You're right - in the key of Am, that chord is Am7 and the 7th note is G, so if you play the 7th of the harmonic minor or ascending melodic minor (G#), while that Am7 chord is playing, you'll be playing G# against that G chord tone. They'll clash, dissonantly

Assuming you want to avoid that clash, the answer is simple.
DON'T DO IT!
Play the note G from the natural minor instead, while that chord is playing.

Assuming you want to avoid that clash, the answer is simple.
DON'T DO IT!
Play the note G from the natural minor instead, while that chord is playing.

:lol: I loled.

But I am intrigued, assuming ??

You mean people sometimes use this dissonance as part of their music and solos ?

And NOW I see what you mean about looking at things as notes instead of scales, because sometimes just one note in this scale will sound wrong ( or right if you are looking for the dissonance O_O ) so I just look at which notes ( not exactly but like an overview ) I will be playing, over a specific chord in the chord progression.

:lol: Im still laughing from your answer :).

Many people assume that dissonance is bad (m'kay?). But it's just as important as consonance, maybe even more so. It's the driving force behind tonal music. So playing the G# against the G will always clash dissonantly, but will it always sound bad? That's a judgement call. In most styles of music, it will be inappropriate for that style. It wouldn't go down too well if you were trying to send a kid off to sleep with a soothing lullabye, but in the soundtrack for astronauts setting foot on a strange alien landscape - perfect.

You've already mentioned that you like the minor-major 7 chord. That too is highly dissonant. Most sensible folks steer well clear of music that contains it, but you and I and all of the people here at GN are open to its inner beauty :D

Many people assume that dissonance is bad (mkay?). But it's just as important as consonance, maybe even more so. It's the driving force behind tonal music. So playing the G# against the G will always clash dissonantly, but will it always sound bad? That's a judgement call. In most styles of music, it will be inappropriate for that style. It wouldn't go down too well if you were trying to send a kid off to sleep with a soothing lullabye, but in the soundtrack for astronauts setting foot on a strange alien landscape - perfect.

You've already mentioned that you like the minor-major 7 chord. That too is highly dissonant. Most sensible folks steer well clear of music that contains it, but you and I and all of the people here at GN are open to its inner beauty :D
lol you crack me up(mkay?)

But yeah I see what you are saying that sound there is in alien movies, and scary movies, like the sound that scares you haha, dissonance is scary.

The min/maj7 chord doesnt have to sound dissonant, right after a I that has a bit of an emphasis on the third note, because that third note is the min/maj7ths maj7th, it can sound quite beautiful 8), but yeah alone it can be quite strong to untrained ears.

lol yeah we are open to dissonance, we should make a dissonance scale like starting from C

C-D#-F-G#-A#-C

EDIT: Hah I feel stupid, those are notes from the G# major scale but started from C ( and missing a few notes in between) lol I thought it would sound bad O_O.....

Ignore that I have another question

You used the word consonant, as the opposite of dissonant, does this word have any relation to the word consonant ( as in B C D F G H J K L M N O P Q R S T U V W X Y Z ) ?

If you rename some of those notes of your scale, you'd have F pentatonic minor (F Ab C Eb F) or Ab pentatonic major (Ab C Eb F Ab) starting from C. BTW, don't think in terms of keys like G# major. It contains 8 sharps and doesn't have a valid key signature. Think A flat - which has 4 flats.
If you want a dissonant scale try the whole tone scale, all of the triads of this scale are augmented!!

I don't know of any connection between consonant letters in language and consonant intervals in music, except that both come from the same Latin roots, meaning "sounding together".

BTW, don't think in terms of keys like G# major. It contains 8 sharps and doesn't have a valid key signature. Think A flat - which has 4 flats.
If you want a dissonant scale try the whole tone scale, all of the triads of this scale are augmented!!

WHOA all the triads are augmented, haha it would be so funny to tell that to some1 who doesnt know about music, with the exclamation mark and a really serious look on your face, I read about it, but I thought it was too much of a hassle to learn it, it doesnt even have a tonal center O_O.

Whole Tone Scale, I bet the members here at GN love this scale, since we all can see the inner beauty of dissonance :P.

Yeah i read about the sharps and the flats, but I havent really gotten around to counting the sharps and flats in the scales o.o. Is there any short cut to learning them or do I have to stuff em in my head ?

[Yeah i read about the sharps and the flats, but I havent really gotten around to counting the sharps and flats in the scales o.o. Is there any short cut to learning them or do I have to stuff em in my head ?

It's not too hard to learn about the sharps and flats in the scales once you realise that there's a logic behind it.

Start with the guitar friendly keys, C G D A & E, (which also happens to be the chords of Hey Joe). Each key in that list has one more sharp than the previous key.

C has no sharps or flats
G has 1 sharp (F#)
D has 2 sharps (F# & C#)
The logic is starting to appear. Notice that the key of 2 sharps includes the same sharp (F#) as the key with one sharp plus one more sharp (C#).
A has 3 sharps (F# C# & G#) Again, the first two of those sharps (F# & C#) are in the previous scale and the new sharp is G#.
You can probably guess that the next key, E which has 4 sharps will contain the previous 3 sharps (F# C# & G#) plus one more. That next sharp is D#.
You can also see that each new sharp that has been introduced is the leading note (7th degree) of the scale. To see all the keys with their sharps and flats arranged in this logical order, you should look at the" circle of fifths". I've made an interactive circle of fifths on my site. http://www.fretsource.com
The keys are all arranged separated by 5ths (as I did above). You can click on any key to see the scales including the triads that are contained in each major and minor key.
Helgi (Hbriem) has some nice charts showing all the sharps and flats for each key in the same logical order. If he's reading this he might post them.

Key Minor Signature 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th 7th
C major A minor C D E F G A B
G major E minor # G A B C D E F#
D major B minor ## D E F# G A B C#
A major F# minor ### A B C# D E F# G#
E major C# minor #### E F# G# A B C# D#
B major G# minor ##### B C# D# E F# G# A#
F# major D# minor ###### F# G# A# B C# D# E#
F major D minor b F G A Bb C D E
Bb major G minor bb Bb C D Eb F G A
Eb major C minor bbb Eb F G Ab Bb C D
Ab major F minor bbbb Ab Bb C Db Eb F G
Db major Bb minor bbbbb Db Eb F Gb Ab Bb C

Huh? What?