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Topic starter
31/08/2009 2:47 pm
If we are playing a C blues using just the chords of C7, F7, and G7, is it okay to talk of this progression as using just secondary dominants? Or is a 7 chord only considered a secondary dominant if it resolves to the I chord of the scale it is a 'pure' dominant of?
As I understand it, secondary dominants basically involve taking e.g. the Cmajor scale, and making every chord a 7th chord, if playing in C.
<Scrybe sacrifices a tone-deaf goat at the alter of music theory wisdom in thanks for this question being answered>
31/08/2009 3:36 pm
Many people call 7th chords secondary dominants if they're not built on THE dominant (i.e., 5th) scale degree. But, strictly speaking, the term refers to the function of the chord, rather than the chord itself. That means that it needs to resolve to the chord a perfect 4th higher to really justify the name. (e.g., D7>G in the key of C).
This doesn't apply to the true dominant 7th though. As long as it's built on the dominant scale degree it's the dominant 7th even if it doesn't resolve to the I chord. But if it's built on any other scale degree we can't say it's a secondary dominant unless we see that it's acting as a dominant 7th to the following chord (which it treats as a new I chord).
In your blues example, G7 is a true dominant 7th and F7 isn't resolving anywhere. That only leaves the C7, which is progressing up a 4th to F7 as would be expected of a secondary dominant - BUT this is blues and C7 is the I chord. 7ths are the norm throughout. I guess, at a push, you could call it a secondary dominant 7th just before it changes to F7 - but that sounds like just playing with words to make the term fit a type of music it was never devised for.
If my answer doesn't justify sacrificing a tone deaf goat, I'll settle for a rhythmically challenged chicken instead. :D
Topic starter
31/08/2009 4:59 pm
You can have both! <Scrybe runs off to find a rhythmically challenged chicken...>
I thought the term "secondary dominant" would have to do with its function, resolving as you say to make a V-I progression. But I wasn't sure, and I'm fairly certain I've heard the term used in a few texts where the example is more akin to my blues example than one where the chord resolves. I have learned not to trust books. At least, not blindly. I'm clear on this one now, thanks Fretsource. And there's a cow with ugly timbre waiting for you if you can deal with my Q on tritone substitutions. Whether or not said cow is none other than Britney Spears, I cannot possibly comment. :wink: :evil:
31/08/2009 5:44 pm
+1 on Fretsource's answer.
Quick addition: secondary dominants result in a temporary change of key. In blues, one traditional approach is to use 7th chords on every scale degree. Since you're not changing key (it's all still blues in C), they're not secondary dominants.
But let's say you have a blues like this:
C7 | F7 | C7 | C7
F7 | F7 | C7 | C7
G7 | F7 | C7 A7 | D7 G7 |
The A7 and D7 are secondary dominants - D7 is the V/V, and A7 is the V/V in the key of D. You're temporarily changing keys (twice).
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Topic starter
31/08/2009 5:59 pm
Sweet, read and understood, thanks Noteboat.
Anyone know a regular supplier of tone deaf goats? If I hav many more Q's, I'll need to restock...
31/08/2009 7:56 pm
Anyone know a regular supplier of tone deaf goats?
Any punk concert? :D :D
I started with nothing - and I've still got most of it left.
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31/08/2009 8:20 pm
You're temporarily changing keys (twice).
Ah! Lights go on!
Really, that has bugged me for ages.
Good info; thanks! :note2: